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countygirl - > Wake up Tehachapi !! -> No Hugging Allowed!
No Hugging Allowed!

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id...

I just came across this article and it is absolutely ridiculous in my opinion. I could understand if this was a make out session or something , but a hug. Give me a break! What are your thoughts on this? Are things being taken to far?

 

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posted by countygirl on Wednesday, November 7, 2007 at 09:52 AM
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30 comments from 11 users

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posted by Colitas on Nov 7, 2007 at 10:54 AM
It's crazy and way out of hand.  I am sure there are other things that probably need more attention. 
posted by rm6 on Nov 7, 2007 at 10:55 AM
I think that is absolutely absurd. If I'd've gotten detention for hugging my friends at school, I'd've been irate.
posted by bigdog on Nov 7, 2007 at 11:09 AM

Common sense has gone out the window. My daughter would be suspended all the time because she's a hugger. And I think that's a good quality. Yes it goes too far. Teachers can tell if a hug is just that a hug or if it is sexual. Common sense is slowly disappearing from or society. I shake my head and roll my eyes in disbelief. In many cases  i think organized sick outs or the students would be the most effective way of telling school administrations and school boards that they are wrong. you have to hit them in the pocket book to get their attention. One more reason for school vouchers.

posted by countygirl on Nov 7, 2007 at 11:20 AM
I couldn't agree more bigdog!
posted by oohchild on Nov 7, 2007 at 01:48 PM

Interesting side note: Utah just rejected a school voucher plan.

http://www.au.org/site/News...

"Utahns voted 60-40 percent to nullify a sweeping voucher plan passed by the legislature earlier this year. The vote, said Americans United Executive Director Barry W. Lynn, is another reminder of how unpopular voucher plans are.

“States don’t come any redder than Utah,” Lynn noted, “yet voters were quick to shoot down this misguided plan. Lawmakers in other states need to sit up and take notice.”

 

posted by jer72 on Nov 8, 2007 at 07:41 AM

Awsmom8,

I agree that the schools don't like vouchers because they then have to compete for the tax dollars that they get regardless of where the student attends now. Just imagine if the schools had to compete, they would really have to do some work to ensure the parents trust them enough to educate their kids. Thank God that we in Tehachapi have more good teachers than bad, but I have had my own problems with a few.

What I don't agree with you on is the church and state issue. Everyone loves to throw that into the mix but unless the government is forcing you to take your kid to a church or forcing a religion onto you there is no church and state issue. So to stop the vouchers due to the so called church and state is to me more of a violation than not allowing parents to decide what school to send their kids. The constitution states that the "congress shall make no law respecting an estabishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof" So if some respect by not allowing the vouchers to be used for a religion base school, they in fact are making a law that breaks the first admendment by way of making a law that prohibits the free exercise of religion.

posted by awsmom8 on Nov 8, 2007 at 11:11 AM
Jer- the reason I don't  want school vouchers to be used in religious schools is our tax dollars should not be spent to teach a child his or hers religion during school.  This teaches intolerance and along with religion comes the views associated with that particular religion--intolerance toward gays, anti prochoice, racism, antisemitic, the view that their god is right one, etc.  Granted, this is taught at home by most parents but to teach it in school also just ingrains it more.  I think kids need to go to school in a neutral environment so they can learn and be exposed to others and their differences. That way as they grow up they can make a decsion for themselves about choices and lifestyles. I personally do not want tax dollars spent to educate children in the muslim form of education as is being done in New York.  The school is teaching, along with academics, that the Koran and their god is the only acceptable form of religion and everyone else is condsidered evil. And it is being paid for by tax dollars.
posted by countygirl on Nov 8, 2007 at 01:02 PM

Maybe I'm wrong but I thought the school voucher program was used so YOUR money would go to whatever YOU wanted. So in reality awsmom your tax dollars wouldn't be going anywhere, but where you want it to go. I'm not real familiar with how the program works, but it would seem like this is how it works.

Right now people are paying money to send their kids to school where the word "GOD" isn't allowed to be spoken and creation isn't allowed to be taught, where they are forced to take sex ed, and soon forced to no longer use the term mommy and daddy and share bathrooms with the same sex. Many people do not consider that a neutral environment.

I think it's our money, and we should be able to use it however we wish. Pubic, private, religious,.........It should be our choice.

posted by jer72 on Nov 8, 2007 at 02:55 PM
Okay, I understand your view Awsmom8. However is it right to have people who choose to send there kids to private or religious schools to pay taxes for schools they don't use? Why don't they just make it where those who want to use the public schools are taxed and those that don't don't pay taxes? I know a number of people that pay their taxes and then pay the bill for the private or religious school, in affect paying double the money for each student.
posted by oohchild on Nov 8, 2007 at 03:24 PM

If you folks are allowed to direct your tax dollars away from public education & towards the school of your choice, why should I have to pay any taxes towards public education at all? I've never had a child in school, and yet I'm expected to pay year after year into a system I don't benefit from.

This was said with a huge amount of sarcasm, in case you're unaware. Do you see where vouchers can take you?

posted by Red on Nov 8, 2007 at 03:46 PM

Dog wrote: Common sense is slowly disappearing from or society.  To be thinking this clearly you must have turned off NPR this morning!  I am so proud of you! 

I like the school voucher idea, but wonder if it will make dumb schools dumber and good schools gooder? (that was intentional)

If I CHOOSE to use my vouchers to send my children to a religious school where GOD does exist, that should be a freedom I can enjoy as an AMERICAN. Instead we have uneducated "Seperation of Chuch and State" nut jobs preventing me from doing so.  Does anyone know what the ACLU's position is on this. 

posted by oohchild on Nov 8, 2007 at 03:53 PM

Red, no one is stopping you from sending your kids to a Christian school, or homeschooling if you so desire. Just don't ask me as a fellow taxpayer to subsidize your choice.

I'm surprised that no one has told those flagpole gatherings that God doesn't exist in public schools. Funny, 'cause last time I looked there were plenty of Bibles in public schools, so it's not like the book has been banned or anything. Or are you talking about a different God?

posted by jer72 on Nov 8, 2007 at 04:54 PM

Oohchild,

That is true, if you never had kids, why are you paying for others kids. However, we do need education to advance our country and I do really believe that taxes are needed to create good schools. The problem is that like any service that has no competition, schools won't advance if they just keep getting money without having to fight for it.

I also agree with you that we should have to sudsidize people education if they want to use other than public schools. However if they do choose to use other than public then they should be allowed to have a tax reduction for that choice.

Now about your assumption that there are plenty of Bibles in school is rather funny. The fact is that many schools have subspended kids in other districts for reading the Bible in class during reading times. So far not in Tehachapi but my kids have been afraid to take their Bibles to school.

posted by oohchild on Nov 8, 2007 at 06:17 PM
jer72, please read my posts again. I was being sarcastic when I suggested those who have no children shouldn't have to pay taxes. I support public education because I know it can work - I'm a shining example!

;-)

I happen to believe there's a place for government in a good society, and public education is a cornerstone of my philosophy. Just because a bunch of neocons push the idea that government is always bad doesn't mean I fall for it. I'm not surprised that a group of folks are failing at the very jobs they detest. Would you hire someone who denegrates the job they're applying for?

Anyway, I fully support you encouraging your kids to take their Bibles to school & to read them during "open time." See what happens. The ACLU will always be there to support you should their rights be infringed by the administration. They've done it plenty of times before.

See, there's a lot of people like you who've been misinformed by the media. Some of them are administrators in public schools. Once folks like you are made aware of your rights, then there's little disagreement about free speech rights & the Constitution. But then again, that lessens the fear Christians have about their place in our country & where's the money in that? Ad dollars for O'Reilly & his ilk, or books sales for Coulter & her sycophants, that's what drives the machine. The machine pushes division & mistrust. I'd rather buy elsewhere.
posted by awsmom8 on Nov 8, 2007 at 08:42 PM
Red- So what bible should be used in schools?  There are many religions is the US--do we teach Judaism to all students?  Or do we teach Christianity to all students?  Or do we teach the Koran is the bible? Or is Bahia is the right one to teach?   Which religion is the "right one" to teach? Our founding father made separation of church and state so people could practice what ever religion they wanted to or no religion at all.  This is why there is separation of church and state.  I would be offended if Christianity was taught to my child as I am not a Christian.  Parents need to teach religion, not a government school or a school using our tax dollars.
Jer- you are right--it is lack of competition that has made the schools comfortable enough not to address parents concerns and student needs.
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