http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566 No charges filed over fatal collision MAIT report clears Stallion Springs officer Please unlock the comments on this news article. I would like to comment on it. Why is it locked?   Also why did you delete my post? No charges filed over fatal collision MAIT report clears Stallion Springs officer Please unlock the comments on this news article. I would like to comment on it. Why is it locked?   Also why did you delete my post? en-us  Hey TN when are you going to unlock the comments on the Article? http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_214555 http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_214555  Hey TN when are you going to unlock the comments on the Article? ''censorship''  Not letting people comment on a news article is a form of censorship. Why wont you allow people to comment on the article? http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_214609 http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_214609 ''censorship''  Not letting people comment on a news article is a form of censorship. Why wont you allow people to comment on the article?  I imagine your original post was deleted because you called the officer a murderer. I don't know much about the accident, but I feel it was just that... an accident. Whether it was caused by negligence, poor training, bad visibility at the intersection, etc, we may never know. But I can guarantee the officer never intended anything like that to happen... and to call him a murderer may be a bit harsh (even for you Gube, ha ha!) http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_214744 http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_214744  I imagine your original post was deleted because you called the officer a murderer. I don't know much about the accident, but I feel it was just that... an accident. Whether it was caused by negligence, poor training, bad visibility at the intersection, etc, we may never know. But I can guarantee the officer never intended anything like that to happen... and to call him a murderer may be a bit harsh (even for you Gube, ha ha!) The accident didn't surprise me at all.  The SSPD used to drive all over town following people.  One guy would follow young men around in the city and park up the block from where they stopped.  Creeped me out when he did it to my son.  Since the accident I haven't seen SSPD cruising in the city.  http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_214757 http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_214757 The accident didn't surprise me at all.  The SSPD used to drive all over town following people.  One guy would follow young men around in the city and park up the block from where they stopped.  Creeped me out when he did it to my son.  Since the accident I haven't seen SSPD cruising in the city.   I'm sorry, but the officer was completely wrong!!  He was trained in special driving techniques as all officers are.  He never even slowed down in the intersection which trained officers HAVE to do.  I hope the family wins!!!  I"m praying for them.  And I completely agree with Gube that that is censorship!  http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_214784 http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_214784  I'm sorry, but the officer was completely wrong!!  He was trained in special driving techniques as all officers are.  He never even slowed down in the intersection which trained officers HAVE to do.  I hope the family wins!!!  I"m praying for them.  And I completely agree with Gube that that is censorship!  On second glance...I'm not sorry to say that at all.  I realize the officer will remember this for the rest of his life but he was completely at fault, so there it is. http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_214787 http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_214787 On second glance...I'm not sorry to say that at all.  I realize the officer will remember this for the rest of his life but he was completely at fault, so there it is.    I'm sure there are alot of people in this small area that are affected by this tragedy. For that reason, I can understand why the TN would not allow comments on the homepage article. Comments concerning that are much more appropriately placed in the blog section. This ensures that those people who are affected by this will not have to read/hear the often heartless comments that are placed on articles. Is that censorship, certainly, do they have every right to do that, certainly. Try to put yourself in someone elses shoes. If either of these individuals had been your father/brother etc you wouldn't want to simply get online to read thew news and have to be subjected to those heartless and painful comments. http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_214801 http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_214801    I'm sure there are alot of people in this small area that are affected by this tragedy. For that reason, I can understand why the TN would not allow comments on the homepage article. Comments concerning that are much more appropriately placed in the blog section. This ensures that those people who are affected by this will not have to read/hear the often heartless comments that are placed on articles. Is that censorship, certainly, do they have every right to do that, certainly. Try to put yourself in someone elses shoes. If either of these individuals had been your father/brother etc you wouldn't want to simply get online to read thew news and have to be subjected to those heartless and painful comments.  Since I was not at the accident and I have not seen the report I won't judge the officer until then. However if he didn't slow down as he is supposed to then he was in the wrong. But since he did not intend to kill Mr. Wren I wouldn't call him a murderer. I also have noticed that since the accident I have not noticed the SSPD in town but maybe once and that appeared to be by the TPD's request. As for the censorship goes, I hope this isn't what the new TN GM means by cleaning up the blog. What I saw on both Gube's postings and the ones that was under the story the first day weren't in my opinion over the top. http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_214802 http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_214802  Since I was not at the accident and I have not seen the report I won't judge the officer until then. However if he didn't slow down as he is supposed to then he was in the wrong. But since he did not intend to kill Mr. Wren I wouldn't call him a murderer. I also have noticed that since the accident I have not noticed the SSPD in town but maybe once and that appeared to be by the TPD's request. As for the censorship goes, I hope this isn't what the new TN GM means by cleaning up the blog. What I saw on both Gube's postings and the ones that was under the story the first day weren't in my opinion over the top. Smokey, if the victim had been my brother or father, I would have been enraged by the incredibly rude, arrogant, and dismissive way the family was treated by the Stallion Springs CSD when they went to it, in their pain, for answers. OH...come to think of it, I WAS enraged by their inhumanly shoddy treatment, which shows no signs of abating, with "so sue me" being the only response provided by the public servants that are supposed to be serving them, and us.  I am angered still by the mindless "support the cop, it was an accident, get over it" responses that the aborted efforts to discuss the matter in this site have engendered.  That it was an accident is obvious to all.  That, and the emasculative defensive crouch assumed by all who fear financial or professional damages are the obvious things about this case. The News has allowed critiques to be thrown against others, (Sand Canyon fireman and City Councilpersons come  to mind), but in this - the facts of which we continue to be denied, the News censors to stand not with citizens demanding answers, and not with the rightous anger of a family deprived of a father, but with the same self-interested parties who benefit from denying the facts of the case.  Facts, by the way, that would have been gathered and reported to the public in the intervening months by any newspaperman worthy of the name, official report or no official report. http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_214810 http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_214810 Smokey, if the victim had been my brother or father, I would have been enraged by the incredibly rude, arrogant, and dismissive way the family was treated by the Stallion Springs CSD when they went to it, in their pain, for answers. OH...come to think of it, I WAS enraged by their inhumanly shoddy treatment, which shows no signs of abating, with "so sue me" being the only response provided by the public servants that are supposed to be serving them, and us.  I am angered still by the mindless "support the cop, it was an accident, get over it" responses that the aborted efforts to discuss the matter in this site have engendered.  That it was an accident is obvious to all.  That, and the emasculative defensive crouch assumed by all who fear financial or professional damages are the obvious things about this case. The News has allowed critiques to be thrown against others, (Sand Canyon fireman and City Councilpersons come  to mind), but in this - the facts of which we continue to be denied, the News censors to stand not with citizens demanding answers, and not with the rightous anger of a family deprived of a father, but with the same self-interested parties who benefit from denying the facts of the case.  Facts, by the way, that would have been gathered and reported to the public in the intervening months by any newspaperman worthy of the name, official report or no official report.  I would like to see a outside agency overlook the findings of the Kern County District Attorneys Office. I feel there is some what of a conflict of interest with the Kern County DA and the Stallion Springs PD both being from Kern county. This stinks to high heaven. Eye witnesses said that the cop didn't brake or slow down before blasting through the intersection and running Wren over. How is that not criminal. It makes no difference if it was a accident or not. The cop was negligent. If you or I had blown through a red light and killed a Innocent man we would be facing some type of criminal charge. http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_214834 http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_214834  I would like to see a outside agency overlook the findings of the Kern County District Attorneys Office. I feel there is some what of a conflict of interest with the Kern County DA and the Stallion Springs PD both being from Kern county. This stinks to high heaven. Eye witnesses said that the cop didn't brake or slow down before blasting through the intersection and running Wren over. How is that not criminal. It makes no difference if it was a accident or not. The cop was negligent. If you or I had blown through a red light and killed a Innocent man we would be facing some type of criminal charge.  I witnessed the accident. I am shocked... I  learned only last night of the tehachapi newsarticle regarding this accident. I am very disturbed. Does anyone know if the officer is back at work? http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_215373 http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_215373  I witnessed the accident. I am shocked... I  learned only last night of the tehachapi newsarticle regarding this accident. I am very disturbed. Does anyone know if the officer is back at work?  jme may I ask you a question.......having witnessed the accident do you feel some type of criminal charges should have been filed against the cop? http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_215385 http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_215385  jme may I ask you a question.......having witnessed the accident do you feel some type of criminal charges should have been filed against the cop? What we think is fair verses what the law says is fair generally are two different things. The MAIT is an outside agency with no direct ties to Kern County, from my understanding it is a Sate agency. With that said can't we just leave the issue alone. After all the officer will have to relive that moment for his remaining days. http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_215470 http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_215470 What we think is fair verses what the law says is fair generally are two different things. The MAIT is an outside agency with no direct ties to Kern County, from my understanding it is a Sate agency. With that said can't we just leave the issue alone. After all the officer will have to relive that moment for his remaining days.  This ''issue'' is far from over...............There is a civil suit filed so this will not be the last you hear of this ''issue''. I for one do not believe that the police are above the law. A vehicle is a 2,000 pound weapon and when responding code 3 with lights and sirens the police need to treat it as such. Running a red light and killing an Innocent person is negligent. You or I would probably have been arrested on the scene and been charged in an ''issue'' like this. I hope that the civil trail paints Mr Wren as the real victim that he is. http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_215502 http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_215502  This ''issue'' is far from over...............There is a civil suit filed so this will not be the last you hear of this ''issue''. I for one do not believe that the police are above the law. A vehicle is a 2,000 pound weapon and when responding code 3 with lights and sirens the police need to treat it as such. Running a red light and killing an Innocent person is negligent. You or I would probably have been arrested on the scene and been charged in an ''issue'' like this. I hope that the civil trail paints Mr Wren as the real victim that he is.  I do not think that Police are above the law either. I also agree that a vehicle is a 2,000 pound weapon if done intentionally. I again agree that if it had been a civilian they would have been arrested. To me its mysterious why no one else was entering the intersection at the time. I think that everyone else saw or heard the lights and siren and did what your supposed to and get out of the way. I am in no way saying Mr. Wren didn't care maybe he didn't hear.see the lights and sirens. Is it at all possible that this was a tragic accident? http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_215678 http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_215678  I do not think that Police are above the law either. I also agree that a vehicle is a 2,000 pound weapon if done intentionally. I again agree that if it had been a civilian they would have been arrested. To me its mysterious why no one else was entering the intersection at the time. I think that everyone else saw or heard the lights and siren and did what your supposed to and get out of the way. I am in no way saying Mr. Wren didn't care maybe he didn't hear.see the lights and sirens. Is it at all possible that this was a tragic accident? I'm curious as to why the commenters here feel that they are a better investigation agency than MAIT. The fact is that emotion regarding this matter will dilute any objectivity (as in any investigation). For example, Gube asks jme for jme's opinion on whether or not some type of criminal charges should be filed. So, why would jme's or Gube's or my or anyone else's opinion be relevant on whether or not criminal charges should be filed? We are a society of laws, not anarchy. If it were up to Gube or a few other commenters, they would take the law into their hands and string up the officer. Well, folks, just in case we haven't come to grips with this, this is why blogs and other rantings (my own included) don't control such things. The system of processes controls the outcome (irrespective of whether we agree or disagree with it). All we have here is free speech and to live with the consequences of our free speech. Gube's continual rantings on immigration tend to show this poster is on the extreme edge in some areas, so it is not suprising its off to the deep end.....and let's get a blog posse and hang the officer. But, fortunately, this type of thinking does not control the real world. A process of laws does, whether we agree with it or not....... http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_215709 http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_215709 I'm curious as to why the commenters here feel that they are a better investigation agency than MAIT. The fact is that emotion regarding this matter will dilute any objectivity (as in any investigation). For example, Gube asks jme for jme's opinion on whether or not some type of criminal charges should be filed. So, why would jme's or Gube's or my or anyone else's opinion be relevant on whether or not criminal charges should be filed? We are a society of laws, not anarchy. If it were up to Gube or a few other commenters, they would take the law into their hands and string up the officer. Well, folks, just in case we haven't come to grips with this, this is why blogs and other rantings (my own included) don't control such things. The system of processes controls the outcome (irrespective of whether we agree or disagree with it). All we have here is free speech and to live with the consequences of our free speech. Gube's continual rantings on immigration tend to show this poster is on the extreme edge in some areas, so it is not suprising its off to the deep end.....and let's get a blog posse and hang the officer. But, fortunately, this type of thinking does not control the real world. A process of laws does, whether we agree with it or not.......  I'm not off to the deep end at least not on this ''issue''. Many eye witnesses have said that the cop never stopped before entering the intersection. Some say the cop never touched his brakes. I just refuse to admit that police are above the rest of us. If you or I had ran a red light we would be held accountable. The cop ran a red light and his actions killed a man . He should be held responsible for his negligence. Mr Wren had the right away, he entered the intersection on a green light. Wren was in the right.The cop entered the intersection on a red, The cop was in the wrong. I don't know how or why the powers that be came to their conclusion. I think a Grand Jury investigation is needed. I will be watching the civil case closely. Wren was a good man and I believe that he was worth more then he got. http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_215718 http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_215718  I'm not off to the deep end at least not on this ''issue''. Many eye witnesses have said that the cop never stopped before entering the intersection. Some say the cop never touched his brakes. I just refuse to admit that police are above the rest of us. If you or I had ran a red light we would be held accountable. The cop ran a red light and his actions killed a man . He should be held responsible for his negligence. Mr Wren had the right away, he entered the intersection on a green light. Wren was in the right.The cop entered the intersection on a red, The cop was in the wrong. I don't know how or why the powers that be came to their conclusion. I think a Grand Jury investigation is needed. I will be watching the civil case closely. Wren was a good man and I believe that he was worth more then he got.  Why don't you all wait and read the report?  So far it seems that there is alot of hysteria without getting facts. http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_215751 http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_215751  Why don't you all wait and read the report?  So far it seems that there is alot of hysteria without getting facts.  The CHP wont release the report at least not to the TN. http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_215758 http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_215758  The CHP wont release the report at least not to the TN.  I don't know how it works but I thought a newspaper could get a copy of the report based on the freedom of information act.  I am kind of surprised the family of Wren has not released their copy of the report.  Stallion Springs should have a copy of the report also. http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_216870 http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_216870  I don't know how it works but I thought a newspaper could get a copy of the report based on the freedom of information act.  I am kind of surprised the family of Wren has not released their copy of the report.  Stallion Springs should have a copy of the report also. Mr. Carter, what makes you think that the Wren family has a copy of this report???  What family with a potential civil action against Kern County and Stallion Springs and with an intense and personal interest in the report do you think all this secrecy has been aimed at?? It doesn't take a genius to know that if the report had concluded that if Wren (the dead man) was at fault, it would be all over the news. As for the Freedom of Information Act, that law doesn't only apply to newspapers, it applies to anyone.  Why don't you give Mr. Jagels a call at the DA's office and ask for a copy?  Be sure to report back the reaction you get. Why the Tehachapi News hasn't taken it upon itself to talk to the dozen or so witnesses and write a report of its own, you would have to ask the Editor - or maybe the General Manager,  if you can catch them pausing long enough between their public beratings of Stan Beckham or bloggers, of course! http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_216879 http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_216879 Mr. Carter, what makes you think that the Wren family has a copy of this report???  What family with a potential civil action against Kern County and Stallion Springs and with an intense and personal interest in the report do you think all this secrecy has been aimed at?? It doesn't take a genius to know that if the report had concluded that if Wren (the dead man) was at fault, it would be all over the news. As for the Freedom of Information Act, that law doesn't only apply to newspapers, it applies to anyone.  Why don't you give Mr. Jagels a call at the DA's office and ask for a copy?  Be sure to report back the reaction you get. Why the Tehachapi News hasn't taken it upon itself to talk to the dozen or so witnesses and write a report of its own, you would have to ask the Editor - or maybe the General Manager,  if you can catch them pausing long enough between their public beratings of Stan Beckham or bloggers, of course!  I was not  there.  The only "facts" I know are what people posted and said they saw.  It was a tragic accident.  Cops are not held higher then everyone else.  If it was you or I , we would not have been arrested either.  If it is not criminal or there is no intent, no one is arrested.  If it is criminal, and there is reasonable cause for a peace officer to beleive there is a crime, (such as drunk driving) then an arrest is made.  To say the police officer was not held accountable is false.  He can be and probably will be.  So will Stallion Springs PD and anyone the family"s lawyers can associate with this accident.  These things take time.  If it is proven that the officer did not show due regard to the safety of others on the street that day, then he can, and probably will be held accountable civily.  As for the Police officer and Department not saying anything, they can't, they are being sued.  Thats just the way it is these days.      http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_217196 http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_217196  I was not  there.  The only "facts" I know are what people posted and said they saw.  It was a tragic accident.  Cops are not held higher then everyone else.  If it was you or I , we would not have been arrested either.  If it is not criminal or there is no intent, no one is arrested.  If it is criminal, and there is reasonable cause for a peace officer to beleive there is a crime, (such as drunk driving) then an arrest is made.  To say the police officer was not held accountable is false.  He can be and probably will be.  So will Stallion Springs PD and anyone the family"s lawyers can associate with this accident.  These things take time.  If it is proven that the officer did not show due regard to the safety of others on the street that day, then he can, and probably will be held accountable civily.  As for the Police officer and Department not saying anything, they can't, they are being sued.  Thats just the way it is these days.      Nice Catch-22 there, pgmurphy.  Without the facts, the damaged party can't successfully sue, since they are being sued, the governments withhold the facts.  And you think that's OK? Of course, lawsuits to get the facts may prevail - if enough money and a good enough lawyer is available to the family.   You seem to suppose that the facts will come out, so why do you suppose they are being withheld?  I hate governmental butt-covering.   Its common, for sure - if that's what you mean by "the way it is".  http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_217336 http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_217336 Nice Catch-22 there, pgmurphy.  Without the facts, the damaged party can't successfully sue, since they are being sued, the governments withhold the facts.  And you think that's OK? Of course, lawsuits to get the facts may prevail - if enough money and a good enough lawyer is available to the family.   You seem to suppose that the facts will come out, so why do you suppose they are being withheld?  I hate governmental butt-covering.   Its common, for sure - if that's what you mean by "the way it is".   I feel bad for EVERYONE touched by  this tragic accident. And this was obviously an accident--the officer did not intend for anyones life to end or to screw up for what will be the rest of other peoples lives, including his own.   My husband death was caused by the actions and inaction's of several people, yet I realize it was not done on purpose.  Am I bitter and angry at times?  Yes, but I also have forgiven the people involved.  Hate and wanting revenge can eat a person up alive.  It can self consume you....and ruin the rest of the everyones life if you let it.  Jumping to conclusions  and making accusations about what happened is not going to change anything.     http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_217399 http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_217399  I feel bad for EVERYONE touched by  this tragic accident. And this was obviously an accident--the officer did not intend for anyones life to end or to screw up for what will be the rest of other peoples lives, including his own.   My husband death was caused by the actions and inaction's of several people, yet I realize it was not done on purpose.  Am I bitter and angry at times?  Yes, but I also have forgiven the people involved.  Hate and wanting revenge can eat a person up alive.  It can self consume you....and ruin the rest of the everyones life if you let it.  Jumping to conclusions  and making accusations about what happened is not going to change anything.     I have no anger at the policeman, and as I have said several times, of course it was an accident.  That the officer did not INTEND to hit anyone should be obvious - as it is obvious in every other traffic accident.   So why prosecute ANYONE who has an accident?  Nobody intends to have them.   I have always advocated a very high standard of negligence for accident prosecution.  I think that gross negligence should have to be proven, not merely fault.  Accidents are part of the risk we take getting on the road, and we shouldn't hold our normal screw-ups against each other. So does this man's actions represent gross negligence?  I think it is certainly possible, based on what I understand happened.  Would I be upset if it was found not to?  No, not if that conclusion was reached by reasonable people in possession of all the facts.  That should be the aim of our governmental agencies, and noting that it isn't happening hardly represents jumping to conclusions.  As for a blog response on this site changing anything, gimme a break.  I'm happy that the paper changed the headline on the story, that's more change than I expected. http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_217460 http://www.tehachapinews.com/home/Blog/gube/23566/#c_217460 I have no anger at the policeman, and as I have said several times, of course it was an accident.  That the officer did not INTEND to hit anyone should be obvious - as it is obvious in every other traffic accident.   So why prosecute ANYONE who has an accident?  Nobody intends to have them.   I have always advocated a very high standard of negligence for accident prosecution.  I think that gross negligence should have to be proven, not merely fault.  Accidents are part of the risk we take getting on the road, and we shouldn't hold our normal screw-ups against each other. So does this man's actions represent gross negligence?  I think it is certainly possible, based on what I understand happened.  Would I be upset if it was found not to?  No, not if that conclusion was reached by reasonable people in possession of all the facts.  That should be the aim of our governmental agencies, and noting that it isn't happening hardly represents jumping to conclusions.  As for a blog response on this site changing anything, gimme a break.  I'm happy that the paper changed the headline on the story, that's more change than I expected.